help me diagnose?

[pcgrower274]

Hey guys, think it's finally time to ask for help, I've trawled through forums and tried what I can think of but now luck.

Background: I have successfully grown some decent bud already, in a small PC case, custom made with purple COB LED and small carbon filter, I've done 3 grows till now and each one has been better than the other, no major issues, life was great!

BUT. I was low on room, the grow height is only 45cm, and LST and SCROG can only do so much, I was looking to try topping the plant too at an earlier stage, but haven't tried this yet for reasons below.

I decided to get a bigger PC case, Coolermaster cosmos II, it is much taller, almost 80cm, and wider, instead of 1, 1L grow (yes I litre!), I can fit 2x 2L pots. I built almost the same way, without a carbon filter just an exhaust instead, created negative pressure as I did with the first, only this time I did not use mylar, but a white expensive reflective sheet instead (I'm providing as much detail as possible here)

I did not use the same purple COB Led, instead, opted to create my own LED strips circuit with my own driver, using Bridgelux EB3 slim strips, which measured at 80w at full power, these are a white light. I added these to the side, and used a COB led at the top link: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-Grow-lig ... 4645145893

My issue is, the plant droops/claws past 2 weeks of veg, and the growth is almost non existent. But it starts to grow fine when I move it to the old smaller PC case? Images of droopiness attached.

Here is what I've tried.

Strain - happened to all 3 plants, from seedsman and RQS, all of which recover inside the smaller PC case, my guess it's not the strain or seeds.

Airflow, added fans to the top, to replicate similar airflow to the smaller case, tried increasing and decreasing. don't think this is airflow related

Soil - growing in biobizz, used small amount of rhizotonic, PH always set to 6.1-6.5 for soil, run off is also correct PH, if it was PH, nutrient related, it would suffer slow growth and the droopiness/clawing in both environments?

Water - sites online say it is overwatering, but I water when the pot is light/dry, would also have symptoms in both environments if it was my watering style that is wrong?

Temperature / humidity, both almost identical in both grows, installed a wifi cam inside the box to monitor these, approx 65% during veg, bought a humidifier, and a heater for night time (during the day when it's warmest outside, 29-30c lights on, and 19-21 lights out, can fluctuate a little, but since both enviroments are outside in the garage, both have similar/identical temps/humidity

lights: originally had just the strips, added the 100w COB above to the top, total is 140w actual wattage, smaller (old) PC case only output 60w. I reduced to 60w exact to match the output to the working environment, no use there.

reflective sheeting - since they are different, I thought maybe there is too much light on the plant even though wattage is the same and lights are further away than the smaller PC grow enviroment, so I covered the sheeting with black duct tape, still no use. Could it somehow be the adhesive used behind the reflective sheeting causing something toxic in the air inside the grow?

exhaust- slowed the 4 inch exhaust fan down, maybe it was c02 deprivation if the fan is moving air out too quickly? but no, this did not help either :(

pots, using smart fabric pots, haven't used anything different before, these worked great for me as smaller grows less change of rootbound, I've checked my roots and they are not clumped together, on any of the plants that I've had recently

I honestly don't know what else to try anymore, it's driving me crazy, as soon as I move these unhealthy plants out of the larger environment, they will start to recover and "spring up" towards the light within matter of hours, and within 24 hours, visible growth starts occurring.

both run at 18/6 schedules.

any advice? is it perhaps the lights? anything?!

LINK REMOVED

I don't have any pics of the plants when they've recovered, just had no reason to take any, but I have moved plants back in once recovered, I'll notice almost 0 growth instantly, and then 24-48 hours clawing will start again, and won't go away until I move then back into the other environment, I have tried starting seeds in both environments, but the one in the new bigger case, will start to claw within 1-2 weeks of growth

[Bulls]

My thoughts would be lights . 60w produced from COB leds could pruduce way less light than some of the new LEDs. It might also need to be way further away from the plants.

[pcgrower274]

approx 20 inches from the light at the moment, I cannot increase the distance and they will only get closer as they grow

more pics:

maybe I should take the purple cob led from the smaller grow, move it into the big box? As light's are the only variable other than fans that aren't the same..

[pcgrower274]

My thoughts would be lights . 60w produced from COB leds could pruduce way less light than some of the new LEDs. It might also need to be way further away from the plants.

right okay, maybe my lights are too powerfull for the grow space I have. I believe I calculated it once at 1.6m3

[Bulls]

Try with what you said, replace the lights and see how they react. Leave them on 18/6. In my opinion plants like some darkness.

[pcgrower274]

Try with what you said, replace the lights and see how they react. Leave them on 18/6. In my opinion plants like some darkness.

Perfect thanks Bull, appreciate you taking the time to respond

[pcgrower274]

Sounds like too much light.

In a pc case I'd kit it out with T5 tubes, CFL lamps etc. You can get them inches from the plant, COB LEDs... I keep a good 20 inches away or I get troubles.

Good luck dude.

right got it, I will swap the lights, and if that works, I'll get some T5 tubes or CFL lamps, time to research grow lights again. My knowledge is mostly on LED strips since I read they can be kept very close to lights but maybe that's all wrong and I should go 'old school' and ditch the new technology

[pcgrower274]

Sounds like too much light.

In a pc case I'd kit it out with T5 tubes, CFL lamps etc. You can get them inches from the plant, COB LEDs... I keep a good 20 inches away or I get troubles.

Good luck dude.

right got it, I will swap the lights, and if that works, I'll get some T5 tubes or CFL lamps, time to research grow lights again. My knowledge is mostly on LED strips since I read they can be kept very close to lights but maybe that's all wrong and I should go 'old school' and ditch the new technology

Have you seen the 'space buckets' on this here internet that folks grow in?

Whenever I see the plants with a LED right on top of them, they look fucked.

All I know is under my T5 strips when I'm vegging a plant, they are healthy as hell and the T5 is an inch or two away from them... Then I fuck em up under the leds!

I've done grows in kitchen cupboards using 70w CDM lamps and you can get them real close too. Cheap as chips. Lamps come in 4200k and 3000k temps.

Ballast... https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/lighting ... s/0544349/
Lamp... https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/metal-ha ... s/7923543/

thanks for the links too dude! I have ordered the exact ballast and the cdm light too, thanks again!

[pcgrower274]

Are you ok wiring stuff up?

You a ordered lamp holder too? G12 I think they are. Fleabay are probably cheapest for those.

I held fire for a second, I thought maybe I could run two bulbs with different colour temp so I have better spectrum overall for both veg and bloom.

I'm also looking at pictures of bleaching plants online (if that is the correct term for it) and this doesn't look much like it?

image is from today, same plant, same soil, same temps, same humidity, same water, same pH different lights, just 2 weeks later, in the old pc case.

I will now move it back into the new grow environment, but found this post online that says to remove the lenses or in my case lens cover that are put over the cob led lights, this reduces the extra magnification that's added due to the lens, so I have removed and will see in 24-48 hours if the drooping starts again, plant is toast now anyway..

[pcgrower274]

Okay 48 hours later update:



Was not the lens cover. Feel like pulling my hair out, doesn't look like light bleaching either, thoughts?

Looks like over watering, but it's definitely not, temps humidity the same, water the same soil the same, driving me nuts this!